Ideal idle time to log out character and leave at account screen?

[Rias]

I've got a mechanic set up to have logged-in characters be logged out if idle for too long. This will log the character out but leave the player connected at the account screen. This should help with:

- Awkward situations where characters have been AFK in the same spot for hours/days. This is weird for everyone.
- People getting covered in severe frostbite because they went AFK while outdoors and the weather was/turned cold.
- People going AFK out on the roads in Octum before sunset and then getting mobbed by wandering spirits after sunset.
- People going AFK in a semi-safe area/situation and then getting killed when the "semi" part of that flips to the unsafe side. (Looking at you, people who hide and then go AFK in hostile zones.)

The big question is: What's a good time limit for this? 10 minutes? 15? 30? Anyone with an opinion on the matter, please post here in this thread. (Please don't post final thoughts on the Discord/OOC chat channels without also posting them here. Staff can't (and don't try to) keep up with everything on the OOC chat channels.)

Also: There are potential plans for some way to hear the most recent ESP echoes somehow, for those who worry about not knowing what's been going on over ESP while they were logged out.

[Serity]

30 would be my suggestion, personally.
10 or 15 would get annoying when people are sitting in social situations and step away for a few minutes to handle some matter (I think 5 for the AFK-timer there is too short, even, but that is another topic).

[artus]

I'm subjected to one of the many situations above too, given I have a char who just has his energy spent and crashes wherever he's tired all the time. I don't know how long it takes for a bodypart to go from normal to frostbite. Something a bit below that threshold may be ideal.

Also, esp/ say/emote history may be useful in situations where, say, someone's computer decides to die mid rp and they miss most, if not all of what happens after. Giving slight room for them to catch up is a very welcoming change I'd love to see.

[Lexx416]

I'd go with 15 to 20 minutes personally - more than enough time for someone to input a command to ensure they aren't gonna get kicked to the login screen.

[Delphine]

My vote is for 30 minutes with the auto afk timer being extended to 10 minutes (for those of us who type a lot and get tired of having to spam the exp command mid-RP just so you're not constantly getting flagged as afk.) I know this isn't an afk timer discussion, but I feel it goes hand-in-hand with an idle out timer.

However, I know one concern that's been brought up on the Discord before is: what's going to stop the serial afkers from just setting up a timer on their client to send through a random command every few minutes so that they never idle out?

[Lexx416]

However, I know one concern that's been brought up on the Discord before is: what's going to stop the serial afkers from just setting up a timer on their client to send through a random command every few minutes so that they never idle out?

My personal take on it: that's fine, if people still want to script around it, they're doing so with the full knowledge that they're doing so at their own risk (and technically breaking one of the policies). I'd feel a lot more comfortable ICly ignoring people that are infinite-idling in the freezing cold knowing it was a conscious choice on their part (and I'd treat it ICly the same as if they had a trigger go off that caused them to start fighting guards or something similarly dangerous).

[Marcuson]

I think twenty to thirty minutes sounds reasonable. Will the ping command keep us from being logged out?

[Navi]

I feel like the autologout should be more situational rather than based on a time limit. If you are afk idle in your inn room, it doesn't have as much impact as those afk in public locations. Out on the road, I feel like 15 minutes is a good time since that's generally how long I can usually stay outside for before getting frostbite on my characters.
I would also suggest it be an optional choice to enable or disable if the intention is to allow for scripters to circumvent the mechanic, with the default set to on. If not, an addition to the scripting policies in this specific case may be needed.

[Teri]

I think an hour would cover some of those cases while also getting the gist of network transmission (I like the idea of recent esp stuff) Frostbite takes a while to kick in. My opinion on hiding then afking in a hostile zone, is well that just seems high risk in the first place? And logging out then in while in hiding I believe takes one out of hiding so if in a dangerous zone would be deadly depending on their skills. I personally don't like less than an hour as it would impact letting the exp bucket drain while afk in the inn room (As I know I and others have done.)
I like something more situational/location wise.

[Rias]

one concern that's been brought up on the Discord before is: what's going to stop the serial afkers from just setting up a timer on their client to send through a random command every few minutes so that they never idle out?

If they deliberately prevent being AFKed out, they'll have no excuse when Things Happen to their unresponsive trance selves! Beware the bored GM looking for trouble to cause.

Also though, if it seems like an innocent one-off situation, staff can just force the character back to the account screen. We'll handle consistent or deliberate problematic issue cases individually.

The PING command specifically does not reset the idle timer, as we know a lot of people use it to keep their connection alive but not necessarily to rest the idle timer. Similarly, if a connection has done nothing but the same command over and over for long enough, it will stop considering that command as a reason to reset the idle timer. So, anti-idle setups will need to be all the more deliberate, and will make staff feel that much less hesitant to mess with long-term AFKers!

There could be an exception for inn rooms, for people wanting to just let their bucket empty in peace or while AFK.

P.S. As much as staff enjoy causing trouble with AFKers in a little bout of mischievous glee, I don't want to give the impression that anyone is saying that going AFK is a bad or malicious thing. The AFK status is not to shame that character or something like that, it's just there so that others know they may well not get any response if they try to initiate an interaction. People are generally understanding that this is a game we play when we have the time, and sometimes the real world comes up and interrupts that. Going AFK when you need to is fine, and it's considered courteous to let others know via the AFK command or by allowing the auto-AFK timer to kick in when you're genuinely not there or unable to give attention to the game! This pending update to kick long-term AFKers back to the account screen is not meant as a punishment. It's meant as a helpful service to help the AFKer avoid harm/awkward situations, and to the people around them not having to deal with awkward situations trying to help an AFK character avoid harm etc.