Moving player bodies to other locations other than the crypts.

[Rias]

Dragging a player character corpse will now result in the following messaging:

drag corpse
You prepare to drag the corpse of a short stout copper-haired adult woman with fair skin and green eyes.
(You may stop dragging at any time)
========================================
((This is a player character's corpse! As a general rule, only drag player character corpses if you are intending to help the player retrieve their character's corpse. Otherwise, leave it where it is. All instances of dragging player
corpses are logged.))
========================================
Roundtime: 1 second.

As the messaging states, please only drag PC corpses if you are genuinely attempting to help the owner retrieve their corpse/belongings. I've had a lot of time to mull this over, and I just can't see enough overall value to offset the overall cost involved in allowing players to drag PC corpses away for any reason other than to help the owner get their stuff back. As indicated in the messaging, all dragging of PC corpses is logged. There are also associated alerts to keep staff informed of these situations, and GMs have in-game tools to look the logs up as needed.

[Acarin]

Can I suggest then that you lock player corpses in place and have them automatically dragged back by an NPC after an hour (for the situation where they are not recoverable) instead of relying on me not to drag them off and be a good person? I'm just trying to avoid the future conversations in the void which will inevitably occur based on this post (meaning, dragging a corpse part of the way back to town then leaving it could still be considered questionable under this policy because you moved it in the first place or dragging a corpse that has been abandoned for a week to another location that is not right where you're hunting).

[Rias]

I think it'll be pretty easy to tell whether a corpse was dragged closer to an outpost rather than further, intentionally moved off or further from a road, etc. If you're worried about your intentions being misinterpreted, you could just refrain from dragging at all.

[Acarin]

Understood. Can I suggest that this be added to POLICY. I am very interested in seeing what updates end up being made there.

[Acarin]

Also, consider allowing 1 room from the location that the body drops. It does not seem likely that anyone would leave a corpse of their victim in plain sight of anyone traveling along a road. The last body drop that occurred was at the crossroads immediately outside of town and I can't see any rp scenario where a character would think it would be a good idea to leave it there so that the next person entering or leaving starts shouting about it and scheduling town meetings. One room would give someone confidence that the body can be easily found without the scenario of someone randomly encountering it quickly.

[Irylia]

Maybe instead of dragging the body a room away there's some kind of hasty stash option that hides the body in the same room. The body owner can find it without searching, but others would need an ability or active search to see it. Since peer is often not possible in the wilderness due to terrain and environment, this might be a better option so the victim doesn't have to make a circle around the death-room.

[Lexx416]

I'm not entirely sure what the benefit for the community and the game would be for moving player bodies one room away, or otherwise making it more difficult to recover the body of someone. That seems to be in direct opposition to this policy change.

[Acarin]

I'm not entirely sure what the benefit for the community and the game would be for moving player bodies one room away, or otherwise making it more difficult to recover the body of someone. That seems to be in direct opposition to this policy change.

I am not sure that there is much benefit to the community off of many changes but that does not mean there is an issue with the change. There does not need to be an overall benefit to the community off of every change. Do most players experience a benefit from bandits being around? No. Some do though.

Since you asked, the benefit is to the person that killed someone. I really see a problem with leaving a body exactly where it dropped on a major road, potentially right in front of town especially since this game is about rp. Leaving a body in the open gives everyone the opportunity to run across it, announce it, and start talking about danger around the town and who did it. Everyone wants to be involved in rp and the killer may not want to start that based on leaving a body. In some cases, that may be the intent though. In most cases though, the killer probably wants to cover it up. It's very meta to tell us not to move a body to try to cover up a murder. It's not a problem for someone to check a couple rooms if they're guaranteed to find the body quickly. They know where they dropped and can find it quickly anyway.

Irylia's suggestion of stashing it (hiding it in the same room) is a great solution. I don't even see a problem with the individual that died being required to search that room as well (as long as there's not a skill check required for them to find it).

[Lexx416]

Since you asked, the benefit is to the person that killed someone. I really see a problem with leaving a body exactly where it dropped on a major road, potentially right in front of town especially since this game is about rp. Leaving a body in the open gives everyone the opportunity to run across it, announce it, and start talking about danger around the town and who did it. Everyone wants to be involved in rp and the killer may not want to start that based on leaving a body. In some cases, that may be the intent though. In most cases though, the killer probably wants to cover it up. It's very meta to tell us not to move a body to try to cover up a murder. It's not a problem for someone to check a couple rooms if they're guaranteed to find the body quickly. They know where they dropped and can find it quickly anyway.

Irylia's suggestion of stashing it (hiding it in the same room) is a great solution. I don't even see a problem with the individual that died being required to search that room as well (as long as there's not a skill check required for them to find it).

Yes, this game is about roleplay. Hiding bodies sounds like it actively stifles roleplay, while making life harder on the victim - both of these are negative, and actively detract from the game.

If the killer doesn't want the body to generate roleplay, I think the best advice would either be to 1.) not perform the killing action (which is the best option in this case, as it does not allow for the unwanted RP to exist), or 2.) plan their kill more carefully rather than murdering brazenly on the open road. It's not a problem for someone to either delay a kill, or simply not take the action at all. And I believe that a killer who wants to escape from being associated with said kill would be able to be further away from the kill if they did not bother to take the time to drag it, assuming they take the precautions necessary to maintain anonymity.

Metagaming is something that everyone does - it's part of taking part of any game that has mechanics, and in this instance, staff seems to have decided that it's helpful in maintaining an overall positive experience for the community.

[Acarin]

Yes, this game is about roleplay. Hiding bodies sounds like it actively stifles roleplay, while making life harder on the victim - both of these are negative, and actively detract from the game.

I think you're exaggerating and clearly biased. If you know your corpse is in the room you died or within one room of it, you can find it quickly. There are many games where enemies drag corpses around or bury them. The suggestion made is nowhere near that bad. Besides, if the victim didn't want to die, they shouldn't have made whatever choices got them killed or they should accept it and live with the consequences. No one is randomly murdering people without reason.

This definitely does not stifle rp in anyway. It just allows choice of what rp you engage in and the circumstances.

If the killer doesn't want the body to generate roleplay, I think the best advice would either be to 1.) not perform the killing action (which is the best option in this case, as it does not allow for the unwanted RP to exist), or 2.) plan their kill more carefully rather than murdering brazenly on the open road. It's not a problem for someone to either delay a kill, or simply not take the action at all. And I believe that a killer who wants to escape from being associated with said kill would be able to be further away from the kill if they did not bother to take the time to drag it, assuming they take the precautions necessary to maintain anonymity.

Timing is important when killing and I not sure why I would give up opportunities based on OOC nonsense. I understand that you believe that CvC combat should not be allowed (at least for me) but it is and its not going anywhere.

And planning to wait until someone veers off a road is a missed opportunity considering that is where many players spend their time... I disagree with these points entirely. It's not always easy to track someone down or set up an opportunity and its not mechanically enabled to move players while they're alive so that suggestion is basically just saying that you shouldn't kill them again.

If I wanted to not draw attention to a kill, I would drag it out of view of main roads quickly and then get out of there before anyone came. I just don't believe that assertion is logical or warranted. I get that you don't like CvC combat and think it is abusive or trolling and a detriment to the community, but again... this is a combat enabled game and I do hope that the POLICY is eventually updated to reflect this instead of catering to anti-CvC sentiment.

Metagaming is something that everyone does - it's part of taking part of any game that has mechanics, and in this instance, staff seems to have decided that it's helpful in maintaining an overall positive experience for the community.

I think care should be taken to minimize metagaming as much as possible as a general rule so entirely disagree. I would like a positive environment for everyone but one in which decisions can still be made and where players are not insulted OOC for their in game choices. My suggestion or Irylia's would only serve to make the experience better for some people while not harming others.