Berserker feedback and ideas

Peerless warriors of varying types, from hulking armored dreadnoughts to stealthy light-footed nightblades.
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stratcat
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Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:24 pm

Berserker feedback and ideas

Post by stratcat » Sun Dec 27, 2020 5:19 am

Hi!

I'm new to COGG. I might be horribly misguided in my suggestions. I might be missing something. Don't hesitate to point that out if it happens!

I took up the 'serker. I've played around a bit with rage and flurry, which seem to be the cornerstone of the class currently. Flurry is somewhat useful by itself, but it feels like these two things don't do enough to make berserkers unique. I'm trying to find some interesting playstyle here, and struggling.

Another complaint is that fury is pretty hard to generate right now. Dodge, parry and miss a lot, and it will drain rather quickly. I don't often get to use my flurry when hunting mobs. The fights just end too quickly, and then I lose fury while looking for the next foe...

One idea I had is this! Give the 'serker the ability to completely ditch defenses: blocking, parrying, dodging, all of it. Embrace the hurt. Embrace they'll end up in the infirmary a lot. But, through sheer WILLPOWER (I know, I know) and ADRENALINE, the energy loss from the hurt is significantly diminished... until the battle is over. The mad cunt sure is bleeding, but just won't die. What does this do? Well... now we can talk about building up fury.

I'm not sure if there'd have to be something extra to help the 'serker deal with the wounds. I kind of like the idea of them having to rely extra hard on healers, and frequently experiencing the low that comes after the high of battle. Also, "high risk high reward" sounds about right for the class, doesn't it? As does recklessly toeing the line with death.

And then, something multi-target to spend fury on? Or maybe make Cleaving Blow consume a bit and benefit from it?

What do you all think?

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Rias
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Re: Berserker feedback and ideas

Post by Rias » Tue Dec 29, 2020 3:02 pm

I like the idea of making the trade of taking more hits to generate more fury and get more out of that somehow. Some additional fury-spender moves with lower roundtimes but high fury costs might be a cool way to say build up the fury, then unleash a bunch of attacks. Also do note that fury goes toward the Strength stat, which in turn will cause you to do a bit more damage while nice and furious.

Another idea is the classic berserk mode, where you get to a certain point and you just start automatically attacking the heck out of anything nearby with increased speed and power until the rage wears off. Probably with a decent cooldown period, so you don't feel like you should never spend your fury on active moves because you'd rather save it up for the berserk. Maybe cause a bit of Insanity. And of course, sometimes it might trigger automatically without the berserker intending it to, the worse your sanity is. So the more you utilize it, the more likely you're going to find yourself "stuck" in that state. I'm not sure how well it'd work in practice, but it does sound fun.

I'll look into fury generation and think about additional ways to build it up so it can be used more often and feel more like an important part of the Berserker combat dynamic. And yeah, I do like the idea of Berserkers typically taking more hits and being often seen covered in cuts and blood and whatnot. Part of the package, right? Some kind of pain suppression thing would work well for them, like you were saying with the possible decreased energy when from taking hits. The idea of a Berserker just refusing to go down despite normally-mortal wounds, collapsing only after the opponent has been bested, is also awesome to envision. Not to say they'd be immune to death - there'd be limits of course, but I'd love to find a balanced way to make it work.

Happy to hear more ideas if anyone has them. I'd love to develop Berserkers some more and get them really into their feel. I've typically not been much into whole the berserker/barbarian schtick, so feedback and suggestions are extra helpful here. I appreciate the post, it's given me a lot to work with!

stratcat
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Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:24 pm

Re: Berserker feedback and ideas

Post by stratcat » Tue Dec 29, 2020 4:34 pm

Ha. I had that mental image in my head too, with dropping unconscious after battle. If you're planning to work yourself that hard, you'd better have friends to collect you after.

"Berserk mode" and insanity sound great. I guess "anything nearby" potentially involves allies, too, if they're in melee range against the same mobs? That'd make it a bit more situational, which is fine! Maybe it would really just mean the berserker's ally would have to get out of the way for a bit, let them do their thing, and then move back in to cover for that dumb exhausted brute.

I definitely like the idea of there being high stakes involved, be it insanity or bleeding out. But I might be biased since it works beautifully with the character concept I have. It'd be great to hear other voices.

Talyn
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Re: Berserker feedback and ideas

Post by Talyn » Tue Dec 29, 2020 6:44 pm

So, thought I'd post here. I'm new to COGG as well, though I'm not new to RP. Not that you have to play like I do, but I love my Berserker after I made him. The Faewyr are one of my favorite races, and they give me a very big Viking vibe to him as do the Berserkers they're not barbarians they feel more like Viking..Rangers with/if they go Druidry. Sword and board with him and he just shield bashes everything in the face. As for Fury, I haven't really seen a good use for it, however, I also don't have Flurry yet. I do know that after I get 20-25 Fury, I think I saw one combat reroll advantage. I think? With that said, I would really love to see a Demoralizing war cry from them maybe? Like spend 10-15 Fury to let out a rage filled shout that maybe staggers or demoralizes the enemy giving them disadvantage rerolls? Just a suggestion, but with the rest of their CC abilities it's not really needed, more flavor I guess

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Xandrea
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Re: Berserker feedback and ideas

Post by Xandrea » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:21 am

I've played a good bit of berserker. They were my first lv.20. I've rarely had many issues with generating rage. Mostly cause I only use rage spending abilities on enemies that don't go down in a few hits. Kind've like I'm a boss in 2nd stage. Being temporarily indomitable sounds amazing. Especially in the context of trying to kill something when it thinks it has you. Attacking friendlies I don't think is a good idea though. Teamwork is going to be super important late game and I could see berserkers getting excluded from hunting parties for fear of my Berserker accidentally one-shotting them. (A full damage hit from a warhammer and Str attribute is second only to deleting whatever limb it hits)

Touching on the sanity piece. That could be the cost of living past death itself in the moment. Especially if you're already toting mortal wounds. I think it would be interesting to allow berserkers to stay living with mortal wounds but, only until their sanity hits -5. It puts a hardcapped time limit on how long they can fight and has a cost that would require downtime to recover from. Especially if they can't find a physic with mental skills.

The only reason I find hitting allies to be too much is because not everyone is going to be undying and I couldn't live with myself knowing I dealt the killing blow of someone's only life.
A single bell tolls in the dead of night, as one man screams with un-bidden sight. Begging for an end to his plight. Never would his darkness rescind, blighted in his mortal senses. Wishing that he had never noticed the thing which always gazed back.

Talyn
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Re: Berserker feedback and ideas

Post by Talyn » Mon Jan 04, 2021 12:02 pm

So, I've been playing a Berserker for a little while. While I don't have all the abilities, I have a good portion of them that fits the playstyle of the character I want. (Not including druidry stuff that I have to find and haven't yet). However, as a Berserker in general I don't feel rage worthy. A berserker isn't a barbarian, just a warrior who fights in a trance like fury. The modern English word berserk (meaning "furiously violent or out of control"). In a cooperative game I wouldn't want to go out of control and hit an ally but I would love to see more Rage like abilities.

Fury as I think was stated makes the Berserker hit harder at the loss of defense. Although I've had many fights where my Fury was at 25 (Max) and I saw no difference. If you crit, it's usually a kill to a mob that doesn't have armor. Even with armor it's so hard to tell if you actually are getting a bonus or not. (It's the same issue I have with Mighty Blow, amazing ability when it hits and rolls high because you're deleting a mob or a limb from the target with a decent weapon. However, if that ability rolls low then you clearly miss or scratch the target. It should miss but it's still amusing that you blow all your balance for this strike to scratch the target.)

I kinda would love Fury to instead of hitting hard gives the berserkers a higher chance to hit the target, crits are already potent enough to get the job done, but if the Fury resource is intended on being this way perhaps making it where our techniques like shield bash and tackle builds fury would be pretty beneficial for the berserker as well. When you're in a fight, even with a group and you're barely missing the mark to hit the target and not building up Fury kinda is tough, but you're able to hit with techniques. I get it's the luck of RNG at times, but that fury build up would be nice.

I've also been trying to see how the Berserker fits in, Dreadnoughts hit like a freight train, Guardians are super tanky, Marauders get dirty tricks and a few other new stuff, Duelist are finesse, and nightblades are stealthy Right now the Berserker feels like a jack-of-all trades. Perhaps that's just how I'm playing mine. I can use nice weapons, I can use a shield, I can bash people in the face with said shield, I can CC with some stagger and knockdowns, and if I go Druidry (Like I did) I can do a few fancy things like heal myself over time. Being a middle man isn't really a bad thing but a few cool abilities I thought, would be:

Stunning Roar: The Berserker uses his blood filled Fury to give a shout that releases the berserker's anger in a stunning cry. (Could stagger or stun the target for a time causing them to stand in a chilled/intimidated fear) Requires 5-10 Fury

Leaping Strike: The Berserker takes a running charge and leap at the enemy bringing their weapon down on the target. The Berserker moves from the furthest range of combat to adjacent making an attack. -5 balance and can only be used at range.

Lastly, Tenacity: Works like Inner Strength but gives Constitution. A Berserker is renown not only for dishing damage but receiving it and going on.

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