Offensive Casting

Discussion about the occult and arcana in general. (Don't call it "magic" if you want to be taken seriously by scholars.)
Arphaxad
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Joined: Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:59 pm

Offensive Casting

Post by Arphaxad »

It was said, "Regarding the offensive casting question: Occultism/magic will be less pew-pew focused, and more about enhancements, utility, and preparation beforehand. Generally speaking, I don't envision people performing occult rituals mid-battle. But for the sake of argument, let's say there's one that ... I don't know, creates a miniature nether-well and allows you to fling globs of nether at your foes. That type of thing would involve Ranged skill as far as combat offense and defense."

Does this mean arcana is a viable 'hunting' skill?

Could we get a little taste of (examples) what 'enhancements and utility' might be?

Are we talking adding elemental crits to weapons?

Shield/aura spells?

Floating orbs of light?

Summoning elementals or creating golems?

Just trying to capture some ideas/thoughts/questions that have been floating around in various public and private chats.

Thanks!
Arphaxad
Dennis
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Dennis »

I don't know how much of Somnium is carrying over to COGG, but here's some information I saved off the Somnium forum about example enchantments and rituals.

Here's a ritual that Rias whipped up in Somnium. Things may differ in COGG, so take it more of as an example rather than anything concrete!
First we draw a basic ritual area indicator and specify which medium we wish to draw it with. In this case, we'll draw a small circle with violet ilyad paint, a widely-applicable sort of catch-all medium that can be used in most any ritual, if not particularly powerful or suited to anything specific.
draw occult base small circle medium violet ilyad paint
You dip your finger into a clay jar of violet ilyad paint and proceed to draw a small circle on the stone floor.

That circle's going to need some instruction for what it's actually supposed to do. Let's add the "barkskin" glyphs along its border.
draw occult add barkskin medium violet ilyad paint
You dip your finger into a clay jar of violet ilyad paint and proceed to add the "barkskin" glyphs to your occult circle.

This type of thing might be up the Wild Watcher's alley. As long as we think we're in good favor with the Immortal, we can ask for a little specific assistance to increase the ritual's potency. (Note: Don't ask for the help of an Immortal you have no favor with, to say nothing of an Immortal you've managed to offend. They don't seem to appreciate presumptuous people trying to draw on their power.)
draw occult add wildwatcher medium violet ilyad paint
You dip your finger into a clay jar of violet ilyad paint and proceed to add glyphs representing the Wild Watcher.

All right, we've got a small circle that should have the "barkskin" effect, calling on the Wild Watcher for a little extra potency. Being a small circle, it's only got enough room for one person, so let's step inside it.
stand circle
You move to stand within a small occult circle drawn in violet ilyad paint.

Now to activate it, we'll speak a basic activation command.
say amata
You say, "Amata."
You feel drained as your occult circle draws on your spirit to activate!
A small occult circle drawn in violet ilyad paint dissolves into wispy mist.
A writhing, painful sensation ripples across your skin as it toughens! You find your movements to be relatively stiff, but feel more protected from physical harm.
Here's a nifty enchanted bracer that Rias showcased on the Somnium forums, to give an example of what kind of utilitarian enchantments there are.
enc
You're feeling somewhat burdened by the weight you're carrying.

>
exam bracer
You carefully examine a hammered bronze bracer ...
You see nothing particularly unusual about the hammered bronze bracer, save the rune etched into it.
It is a small item, mainly made of bronze.
It is engraved with the following rune: EBLE
It can be worn in the bracelet inventory slot.
After hefting your hammered bronze bracer a few times, you figure it weighs about a pound.
[RT was: 3]

>
wear bracer
You put on a hammered bronze bracer.

>
'Eble
You say, "Eble."
Your hammered bronze bracer pulses with a blue-white light.
Supernatural strength flows through your muscles!

>
enc
You're not carrying too much, you should be able to move about fairly unburdened.

I think it's pretty darn cool. Encumbrance does have an impact on combat, I think, so even something as vaguely applicable as an encumbrance enhancing enchantment can provide the slightest of improvements in your combat ability. Trying to keep references to a minimum, Rias also mentioned things like mortals having a limited Rune vocabulary.
"Therefore, runes will have to be learned and studied a bit before they can be used, and they may eventually have to be re-studied, or perhaps there will be a rune memory limit so characters can swap which runes they want to memorize around."

"Some runes might only be studied in out-of-the-way places, making it a little mini-quest to be able to activate your nifty enruned item you found. They'll also probably be, for the most part, limited-use. I know, I know, I have an obsession with items that have a shelf life. But as I always say, I don't want the world to be flooded with super duper occult uber items. There may be the rare occasional legendary item with unlimited rune usage. We'll see."
Anyway, I hope that gets you excited for magic.
"Always remember that we are a community before anything else. Before being a 'game' or a 'world' we are a bunch of folk who get together to have fun."
Arphaxad
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Arphaxad »

Thanks Dennis,

That helps a bit. Please bear with those of us who didn't participate in Somnium if we ask redundant questions. The ritual construct looks interesting. I'm beginning to think that this stuff is going to have to be discovered ICly in game.

Arphaxad
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Rias
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Rias »

If you want your character to be sustainably and directly combat-apt, you shouldn't rely solely on arcana. Occult powers can be used offensively if you've had the opportunity to prepare them for such, but don't expect to be able to run around looking for fights and constantly throwing out a barrage of magical attacks. I'd suggest taking some Melee or Ranged skill, and then you can use various occult effects to enhance your gear and/or prepare for battle ahead of time when possible with traps, snares, debilitators, delayed effects, and preemptively-prepared but limited powers. If you just want to be able to protect yourself should it come up - rather than going out and constantly seeking combat - you could get by without training combat skills by using some powers that can be prepared beforehand in a limited supply (see the end of this post for more on that), but don't expect to do as well as someone who's specifically trained for such situations (those with actual combat skills).

Let me toss out a few potential occult rituals. Many will be familiar to those who played CLOK. Keep in mind that characters should only expect to utilize one overarching branch as categorized below. So no sorcerer-druids or druid-thaumaturges or sorcerer-thaumaturges. Or sorcerer-druid-thaumaturges. While some sorcerous abilities may be available to anyone with the skill to learn them (provided they can find an opportunity to study them), expect more advanced ones to require special knowledge provided by a guild or similar. The ability to utilize druidry will require a guild or otherwise specialized training, and thaumaturgy ... I'm honestly still trying to figure out how to handle that one.

Druidry:
- The above-quoted "barkskin" ritual in a previous post.
- Calling on the Bear Spirit to infuse one with brief supernatural strength.
- A cleansing ritual to help remove blight from the local flora or revitalize wilted growth.
- Granting temporary camouflage.
- "Awakening" a wooded grove in preparation of the arrival of intruders that will be assailed by lashing roots and entangling vines and such.
- Infusing a totem with nature's vitality, able to be activated by the bearer for a period of increased energy regeneration.

Sorcery:
- Ensorcell a bracelet with a curse, causing it to latch onto the wrist of the next wearer and slowly drain their spirit. Removal would require either a Thaumaturge or a rather painful surgery.
- Do similar to the above, but with a weapon. Sure, it latches to the wielder and drains them, but imagine how much easier it might feed and be temporarily sated were it to come into direct contact with the blood of your foes as you strike them.
- Summon nether and willingly allow it to bond with bloodied incisions made between the knuckles to extend into claw-like appendages.
- Invoke a local haunting, causing nether-spirits to harass anyone not welcome by the caster.
- An involved (and dangerous!) ritual to separate a portion of one's own soul into another entity sustained by nether, often referred to as a "shadow familiar," to be called on for various tasks from harassing or attacking a target to guarding an item in an area.
- Task a shadow familiar with animating a suitable corpse, or prepared otherwise-inert matter as a golem.
- Set a nether-infused circle to lash out at the next person to walk into it with tendils of nether.

Thaumaturgy:
- A thaumaturgic blessing causing flesh wounds to regenerate over time.
- Set a powerful warded circle through which nethrim cannot pass.
- Bless a weapon to deal greater damage to nethrim.
- Bless a vial of water for further use in rituals, a small vitality boost when drinking, or THROWING AT NETHRIM BECAUSE CASTLEVANIA
- Infuse allies with thaumaturgic Light, strengthening their spirit and toughening their physical body a bit.
- Set a temporary light source in an area or attached to an item.

Some of these could be prepared ahead of time via crafting a sort of enchanted item in order to be utilized more immediately, so you do all the ritual prep work beforehand on an applicable item, and then you can do something to activate that item at any point later to immediately get the effect. This won't be an option for more powerful and involved powers, though. And having too many enchanted objects all gathered together in close proximity (say, in an adventurer's worn containers) would result in Bad Things, so you can't just carry 500 enchanted items around with you as some sort of Instant Occult Arsenal. So there are still some limitations in picking and choosing which you want to have on you and ready for immediate use.
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Rias
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Rias »

P.S. I've since reconsidered my stance against pew-pew casting. It will still require some kind of additional combat skill to utilize casting in combat, but at least some forms of channeling will be useful as primary means of combat, such as using sorcery to fling freezing/corrosive nether at foes.
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Rastaban
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Rastaban »

This is good! But what do you think about defensive casting? For someone who would not be good at dodging or using weapons or shields, but able to use magic defenses instead?
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Rias
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Rias »

I'm considering how to handle occult defense abilities. It will likely still require some kind of item, as well as a skill other than the magic skill used to unlock spells. My main worry is the frequent game trend of:

Warrior:
Offense: Weapon skill
Defense: Shield and/or Dodge skill
Survivability: Armor skill

Mage:
Offense: Magic skill
Defense: Magic skill
Survivability: Magic skill

I feel that magic users should have to train multiple skills just like non-magic-users in order to be able to handle the same diversity level of situations.

Anyway ... I'll get off my soap box now and say that yes, there will probably be a way for magic users to defend themselves in dangerous situations without using conventional weapons/shields and their related skills, but will still require extra skill investment beyond just a single magic skill they would have been investing in already anyway. And it probably won't be quite as effective as the more dedicated-combatant conventional methods, overall.
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Rastaban
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Rastaban »

Hello, I was wondering if there was any more consideration for defensive casting? My character is old and frail. I would never wish to train him in dodge, his is not quick or nimble. He is not Yoda. I have trained him in some with ranged combat, for using sorcery, but even this feels wrong. I understand the logic. I do not argue that I wish to be able to do everything with sorcery skill alone. But I wonder, can there be some compromise of some kind? Some kind of way to target spells, and defend with spells, that is not also physical combat training? Defense would require a new spell of some kind, see Rasui's Cryosorcerous Disc for an example for blocking. For dodging, perhaps kinds of illusions? I have two ideas for how we can still require additional skills, but not need every mage to be trained in physical combat.

First idea, is new skills to train. Mental Marksmanship, for aiming spells to attack. Mental Reflex, for reacting with defensive spell shields to block or illusions to mislead(dodge). These do not even have to be better than Ranged Combat and Dodge or Shield Use for magic. They are there just for characters who are not so physically fit and use magic instead to make up for this. The bent over wizards, the hunched witches, the corpulent or frail scholars who spend all time studying and not exercising. With these new skills to train, we still need to train many skills, and not just Sorcery, or Druidry, or Thaumaturgy, or Arcana. But if your mage is physically fit? Better to train Ranged Combat, and Dodge, and get more effect for your points.

Next idea, is use some abilities to divert other scholarly skills into attack and defense. Power of Mind Offense I-IV: Every rank, your scholar skills except Sorcery, Druidry, Thaumatury, or Arcana, are lowered for their intended effect, but instead they will consider partially toward attack spells. Power of Mind Defense I-IV, the same but for defense spells. So you see again we will still need to train many skills, and even will have to sacrifice some for our magical means of doing things instead of physical.

If these are not what is expected of this world then I will understand, but I wanted to make my case for some ways for us ancient old scholars to hold our place when it comes down to unavoidable battle, in a more logical fashion than physical combat training.
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Lexx416
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Lexx416 »

I think having a way to partially supplement defense with some kind of Arcana thing would be nice, for those who choose to not take any of the Physical Combat Stats - but it should probably be fairly inefficient to do so, similar to how the Dance skill can be used in place of dodge at a hefty penalty (but probably moreso, considering how directly useful and effective magic is).
"You hear the Woses, the Wild Men of the Woods... Remnants of an older time they be, living few and secretly, wild and wary as beasts."
Acarin
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Re: Offensive Casting

Post by Acarin »

Apologies for this but just curious about how you are thinking about this. If your character is old and frail, why would he be engaging in combat in the first place? Noncombat characters are very viable.

Also, no thaumaturgy here... for PCs at least.
You reach toward ((DEV Rias)) ... Pull(d225([1]x)):214 vs Mark(d1100):714 = -500 (-222%)
You notice ((DEV Rias)) glance your way, causing you to quickly withdraw your hand from his wool
drawstring pouch (open).
Roundtime: 5 seconds.
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